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Invader [STEAM_ 0:0:38344795]



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#1 Invader

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 07:03 PM

Hey guys, I'm writing this because I want to get a few things sorted out and kind of express myself along the way. First off, I owe a big apology to those who I may have hurt or insulted. I broke the rules fair and square. I'd just like to say I have a huge, huge, competitive attitude,which is a big part of why I like playing TF2 center. I'll be the first to admit I can be rash, abrasive, and all around a big trash talker. To me, that just kind of comes with the competitive scene. But trust me, I'm not using that as an excuse. I admit I was wrong for saying those things and in no way do I have any justifications. I'm not an idiot, I can self reflect and I definitely see how my comments were hurtful. I just got caught up in the moment.... which brings me to my next point...I feel a warning, or at least a temp ban would suffice. Isn't that what moderation and rules are for? To teach us along the way? We all make mistakes, we all break rules. Well why on a first offense give a perma ban? And trust me, I'm not trying to minimize the things I've said and the rules I've broken. I know I was wrong to do all of that. But I'm just asking for my ban to not be a perma... I've self reflected and learned my lesson.
 
Steam ID : STEAM_ 0:0:38344795 
 

Edited by jayserp, 31 July 2014 - 04:25 AM.


#2 Luop90

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 08:15 PM

Ban Dodging, Offensive Language, Inappropriate Behavior.

If that doesn't spell perma-ban I don't know what else would. (Besides hacking).

The moderating team had a consensus to perma-ban you. You ruined several lobbies by griefing and trolling other players, and to back it up, after you got banned from the lobby, you joined on an alt to keep going. This is hardly "caught up in the moment", especially since it was spread over several lobbies. You clearly knew what you were doing.
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#3 Marty

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 01:17 PM

Well even though he did something really naughty he did apologize for it, and I think it's a bit much to give him a perma ban for a first offense? There were several offenses in a single session, but to just straight up ban him forever for it is a bit much. A 1 or 2 month ban sits fine dont you think?


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#4 Taddy

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 02:56 PM

No offense Marty, but you tried to get me banned for a month for calling you socially retarded and other petty things. I don't see how this scales even remotely close.

 

Invader has dropped homophobic terms and severe language on multiple occasions with multiple people. I always see this player taunting and using binds towards the players he's killed while sitting with a friend stack. I originally wanted Invader to be temporarily banned from the site for the harassment, but using another account just to continue harassing someone is very extreme. You found yourself being kicked out of several lobbies yet continued to act the way which leads me to believe you truly aren't sorry for your actions. 

 

Four days ago you were bragging in chat that you've been reported over a month ago and still not banned. I feel like it will be the same bragging story if you do get your ban appealed.

 

U35tNa0.jpg

 

I don't know how I feel about permanently banned right now, but I do believe you're only sorry someone finally took action. 


Edited by Taddy, 29 July 2014 - 03:00 PM.


#5 mizx

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 05:02 PM

I've got stuck playing with him and his friends and it most definitely is not pleasant, yet I'm stuck playing there unless I want to sacrifice my rage quits/reliability. During games Invader and his friends are constantly yelling, trolling, and constantly have inappropriate behavior. Whenever I saw him or his friends in a lobby, I'd leave and wait for the next one.

 

I'd side with Luop90 and say there's a strong case built up against him, and I think the decision between the mods is completely justified. This is simply the last resort Invader has. He's already explored all options in regards to further his rule-breaking binge.

 

Thank you mods for keeping disruptive players out of the community.



#6 Invader

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 06:27 PM

I'm gonna be a little abrasive and say,Taddy's right. I'm not sorry for harassing him, it was actually really really fun. He's just some uptight two faced asshole that likes to report people about the smallest things. I'm sure all you admins remember why Marty wanted to ban him. You should hear what people say about him on and off lobbies, just look at how many people he tries to report on these forums. Its cringy af, but me and my friends are genuinely sorry for whoevers lobbies we might have ruined in the past. We're young and immature, but I seriously could care less about this epic generic anime kid called "Taddy".



#7 pussinboots

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 08:47 PM

This seems way blown out of proportion by Taddy, the only rules broken by Invad3r were 1.1 Offensive Names, 2.1 Offensive Language and 4.5 Inappropriate Behavior, a trio of rules that are part of the same kind of "cocky" behavior.

"Ban Evasion" is nowhere on the tf2c rules, and is quite the hefty term, my initial impression was that Invad3r received a tf2c ban and circumvented it by using an alt, which is certainly not the case.

The usage of alts is wide-spread throughout tf2center and needs to be dealt with on its own, the 100 hour minimum is not a solution.

 

Concering Invad3r's actions, he certainly crossed the line with his name-calling, but Taddy and his friend's actions were certainly meant to taunt Invad3r. In the 2nd chat screenshot in the original ban request thread (http://forums.tf2cen...eam-0038344795/), glitter (a friend of Taddy judging by the icon) asked "Who else wants to keep this going?" and "Are you propogating this?" after Taddy has announced he has saved the chat logs and will report Invad3r for a ban. The user "dorkinvad3r" (most likely a friend of Invad3r) calls out Taddy for continuing to escalate the drama but is also threatened so he backs off with a "sorry!!!!" It is at this point that Invad3r's alt account takes a spot in the lobby. It is my understanding that Taddy had previously attempted to ban Invad3r without success; saving a chat log of Invad3r stating the ineffecacy of his previous report in an entirely different lobby only serves as proof of a grudge Taddy holds against Invad3r. Both players acted immaturely, but if you want to ban someone don't announce your reports, it only adds fuel to the fire. Until Taddy's remarks, this would have been simply another Inappropriate Behavior ban appeal, but it is clear that through Taddy's own actions Invad3r was provoked into joining the lobby and changing his name to "You some kinda faggot?" For those not aware, this is a quote from many of Sam Hyde (of MillionDollarExtreme)'s youtube videos, it is no different from all those "funny" offensive binds many lobbiers have.

 

It is understandable that Invad3r got caught up in the moment and overstepped some boundaries to get back at Taddy due to this provocation. The main effect of this perma-ban is Taddy's inflated ego because he "won" the non-existant argument and got back at Invad3r, who has admitted his wrong-doings, whereas Taddy has come to this thread to gloat. In the end this site is about getting people together to play tf2, if people want to shit talk they need to be aware of the rules, I feel like preventing Invad3r from ever playing on this site again goes against that. Sure he likes to talk smack and can be immature and offensive at times, but he still has a massive amount of lobbies played many of which are with his friends. There is nothing wrong with playing with a few other friends and the "team stack" effect of this is inevitable; heck, if it fills up a lobby faster I'm all for it.



#8 Stank

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 09:05 PM

I have to weigh in a little bit here, mostly because I am indeed the player who was dorkinvader at the time. I remember all of it very clearly. I was there the whole time, AND I remember Glitter even COMING into our side of the mumble (since I was opposite team of her) and she began yelling and yelling at me, THINKING I was the real invader. Telling me she was done with my shit and whatnot. So I played the game out, etc, etc. Then at the end of the match, we all gathered in the same mumble. I was then threatened that I was going to recieve a ban myself. Over what? I asked. They said over all the things I said to accompany Invader. Now, as you can see in the screenshots here: http://forums.tf2cen...eam-0038344795/ (remember i'm dorkinvad3r) I really don't see what I did wrong. My whole point here is that they're so overzealous just to get someone banned. And as Pussinboots put perfectly: This is all blown WAY out of proportion. I mean, I was targeted JUST because I'm a friend of Invader. This has become more of a personal vendetta for Tadd. Look, he's even posting in this thread just to gloat, as Pussinboots has stated.



#9 TERRY CREWS

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 09:15 PM

 

No offense Marty, but you tried to get me banned for a month for calling you socially retarded and other petty things. I don't see how this scales even remotely close.

 

Invader has dropped homophobic terms and severe language on multiple occasions with multiple people. I always see this player taunting and using binds towards the players he's killed while sitting with a friend stack. I originally wanted Invader to be temporarily banned from the site for the harassment, but using another account just to continue harassing someone is very extreme. You found yourself being kicked out of several lobbies yet continued to act the way which leads me to believe you truly aren't sorry for your actions. 

 

Four days ago you were bragging in chat that you've been reported over a month ago and still not banned. I feel like it will be the same bragging story if you do get your ban appealed.

 

U35tNa0.jpg

 

I don't know how I feel about permanently banned right now, but I do believe you're only sorry someone finally took action. 

 

That's honestly just a load of bull to me. I was in that very same lobby when you said you were going to report Invader. You wanna know what the first thing he said to you was? How socially retarded you were. So don't you dare try and downplay things you've said to an ADMIN, while being a hypocrite at the same time.

 

I think it's fairly obvious, since Tadd's been unbanned by admins already, that his and Invader's situations are nowhere near similar. If Tadd were truly trying to downplay his past actions and do damage control, then wouldn't it make sense for him to have remained banned?  When viewed in proper context, Invader's infractions are much more severe than Tadd's, to the point of a former admin mentioned that Invader's actions should fall under cyber bullying (Def. by Wiki as: " the use of information technology to harm or harass other people in a deliberate, repeated, and hostile manner.") Such an accusation should not, and was not taken lightly, resulting in the permaban.

 

Additionally, I fail to see how your statement helps Invader's case in any way, shape, or form.  The first thing he said was to call Tadd socially retarded?  Not a good stance to be in if he's trying to get unbanned.  You also make it sound like antagonizing an admin is not ok, while doing it to other players is.  This would set a dangerous precedent if it were true, resulting in more behavior similar to Invader's; thankfully, that is not the case.  


There is nothing wrong with playing with a few other friends and the "team stack" effect of this is inevitable; heck, if it fills up a lobby faster I'm all for it.

The issue is that, when the friends work together to antagonize other players, there is something wrong, and the wellbeing of the community must also be taken into account.  It's gotten to the point where numerous people have spoken out against Invader(and we're not all friends with each other, seeking a "personal vendetta") It's simply that many of us have negative experiences playing with Invader and co. in the past.  The amount of lobbies you've played should make no difference in the ruling of a ban; earlier this week someone with 2000+ lobbies was banned for behavior detrimental to the TF2C community.  I have a ridiculous amount of lobbies (over 1500) played with friends as well, with no previous infractions.  The difference between me and Invader? I don't seek to harm other players, or disrupt the wellbeing of the community.


Edited by TERRY CREWS, 29 July 2014 - 09:17 PM.


#10 TERRY CREWS

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 10:11 PM

 

 

 

No offense Marty, but you tried to get me banned for a month for calling you socially retarded and other petty things. I don't see how this scales even remotely close.

 

Invader has dropped homophobic terms and severe language on multiple occasions with multiple people. I always see this player taunting and using binds towards the players he's killed while sitting with a friend stack. I originally wanted Invader to be temporarily banned from the site for the harassment, but using another account just to continue harassing someone is very extreme. You found yourself being kicked out of several lobbies yet continued to act the way which leads me to believe you truly aren't sorry for your actions. 

 

Four days ago you were bragging in chat that you've been reported over a month ago and still not banned. I feel like it will be the same bragging story if you do get your ban appealed.

 

U35tNa0.jpg

 

I don't know how I feel about permanently banned right now, but I do believe you're only sorry someone finally took action. 

 

That's honestly just a load of bull to me. I was in that very same lobby when you said you were going to report Invader. You wanna know what the first thing he said to you was? How socially retarded you were. So don't you dare try and downplay things you've said to an ADMIN, while being a hypocrite at the same time.

 

I think it's fairly obvious, since Tadd's been unbanned by admins already, that his and Invader's situations are nowhere near similar. If Tadd were truly trying to downplay his past actions and do damage control, then wouldn't it make sense for him to have remained banned?  When viewed in proper context, Invader's infractions are much more severe than Tadd's, to the point of a former admin mentioned that Invader's actions should fall under cyber bullying (Def. by Wiki as: " the use of information technology to harm or harass other people in a deliberate, repeated, and hostile manner.") Such an accusation should not, and was not taken lightly, resulting in the permaban.

 

Additionally, I fail to see how your statement helps Invader's case in any way, shape, or form.  The first thing he said was to call Tadd socially retarded?  Not a good stance to be in if he's trying to get unbanned.  You also make it sound like antagonizing an admin is not ok, while doing it to other players is.  This would set a dangerous precedent if it were true, resulting in more behavior similar to Invader's; thankfully, that is not the case.  


There is nothing wrong with playing with a few other friends and the "team stack" effect of this is inevitable; heck, if it fills up a lobby faster I'm all for it.

The issue is that, when the friends work together to antagonize other players, there is something wrong, and the wellbeing of the community must also be taken into account.  It's gotten to the point where numerous people have spoken out against Invader(and we're not all friends with each other, seeking a "personal vendetta") It's simply that many of us have negative experiences playing with Invader and co. in the past.  The amount of lobbies you've played should make no difference in the ruling of a ban; earlier this week someone with 2000+ lobbies was banned for behavior detrimental to the TF2C community.  I have a ridiculous amount of lobbies (over 1500) played with friends as well, with no previous infractions.  The difference between me and Invader? I don't seek to harm members of the community.

 

You're saying all of this as if we are unaware of Invader's offenses. I'm pretty sure we're all well aware of what he said, no need to sugar coat things at this point. The fact of the matter is he came in here apologizing for those offenses, and on top of that, Tadd is just here to gloat. You're nitpicking details just to try to invalidate any of my points and, again, blow things out of proportion, when this guy didn't even get a single warning, just a straight up insta, perma ban.

 

I simply commented on what you said because I feel that your points are in fact invalid.  I will do so again:

 

1. "The fact of the matter is he came in here apologizing for those offenses"

So?  He's already committed those offenses, apologizing is simply damage control. In the case that he truly is apologetic, I must apologize deeply myself for assuming otherwise, but calling Tadd an "uptight two faced asshole" and stating "but I seriously could care less about this epic generic anime kid called 'Taddy'." does not seem apologetic to me.

 

2. "Tadd is just here to gloat"

Is it gloating when a victim makes a statement about the offenses committed against him/her?  The clearest example of gloating in this fiasco is in the image Tadd posted of Invader, clearly enjoying the prolonged judgment on his ban request.  

 

3. "blow things out of proportion"

Based on the number of comments and views on the threads related to Invader's ban, I wouldn't say that I personally am blowing it out of proportion.  I argue that Invader repeatedly engaging with Tadd in a negative manner, through his main account, through his alt, through his friends, and through the ban threads is probably what blew it out of proportion.

 

4. "when this guy didn't even get a single warning"

You know that TF2C has a rules page, right?  I understand that you choose whether or not to read them, but when you enter a community that has admins who seek to uphold those very rules, it's probably best that you give them at least a passing glance.



#11 Luop90

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 10:29 PM

As a back up to point #4 on the post above, the rules are your warning. Unless it's chat spam, you will not receive a warning about it. Don't try to say "he didn't get a warning" as a support for his unban. He did get one. It can be found on every header of every page on TF2Center. The "rules" button specifically.
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#12 Tury

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 08:55 AM

I was in a lobby with Invader and I was in the lobby with Taddy when he decided to report Invader. I recorded right after the lobby was over before anyone else did and I think some key things might be missing from this.

 

Invader wasn't that bad to me. When I first joined the lobby and said morning to everyone he was the only one to actually say good morning back :\. He said a few nasty stuffs to me but common it's the internet if you can't handle a cuss word then you need to go watch Disney channel or something instead of going on the internet, not saying that it's right but you know what I'm saying...

 

Since I don't really know much about him or his friends I can't say to unban him or to ban him but I would say this sounds fair. He gets banned for a week or so maybe, then he gets put on a watchlist, he has to be perfect in lobbies, if he does good for a few weeks or months then we leave him be. But if he starts up this activity again just perma ban him and don't let him appeal. So like probation I guess. 

 

Cause you can't really perma ban someone.. If you IP ban them, they can change IP addresses, if you ban their account just make a new one. So just give him a second chance and what not.

 

I vote No to perma banning him. 

 

Everyone deserves a second chance no matter what they do.


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#13 Marty

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 09:35 AM

I suggest that Invader gets unbanned or atleast gets his ban shortened. He broke the rules quite severely, but he didn't do anything close to an instant perma-ban. Permaban is saved for DDoS attacks, sedition towards TF2Center and violation of law.

 

I know that there are a lot of personal vendettas in the NA lobby scene, but how about we just leave eachother alone? If you don't like Tadd, don't play lobbies with him. If you don't like Invader, don't play lobbies with him. If you know you're going to have forced interaction (if someone joins as sub and enters your mumble etc.) start recording what happens if you want to, and if anymore of these situations occurs leave it to the admin team to decide.

 

Quoting Kkaltuu: Drama is for kids, stop it.


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#14 Luop90

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 06:25 PM

Hid discussion posts, as this isn't a discussion forum, and locked the thread until the moderators have reached a decision.  


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#15 jayserp

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 04:24 AM

The moderators have come to a general consensus of reducing this ban to 1 month as of today. The ban will expire on the 30th August.

 

Any use of alt accounts, or breaking of the rules between now and then will result in a permaban.


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